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Stream of Consciousness, Epiode 5.15

family dont end with blood

I have to say … they could have sat in the middle of an empty room on barstools and stared at me for 50 mins and I would have been happy to see them. *grin* Okay, this is well and truly a ramble and completely unedited because I’m tired, so please forgive typos, etc.

 

Just because I'm sorry doesn't mean I didn't enjoy it at the time… Collapse )

 


Comments

( 79 Tall Tales — Tell Me A Story )
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amber1960
Mar. 30th, 2010 07:59 am (UTC)
Just remembered to check your review (I keep forgetting - how unlike me with my razor-sharp memory...?). I found this a strange episode; on first watch I found I had enjoyed it, laughed at the funnies, been grossed out by the yucky bits but was oddly unmoved by the angst. Which wasn't what I'd been expecting, having seen the trailers and read Jim's tweets/FB posts about how he had dealt with that storyline. Then I left it a while and watched again - and suddenly found it a lot more moving and poignant second time around.
Then I picked up the parallel with Heart where Dean was clearly willing to take the burden of killing for Bobby (even though as some other comments have pointed out above, it was something Bobby would need to do himself), just as he had with Sam and Maddison and that was very sad. And the scene at the end with the overhead shot of the pyre, Bobby flanked by the boys looking sadly diminished in his chair - *sniff*.
There were some very nice scenic shots in this one (and I don't mean Jensen who is always incredibly scenic!!) - a great one of the Impala with Bobby's house in the background, Bobby in the yard in the night waiting for the zombies, then that one of Karen's pyre at the end as the crane pulls the camera up and back so you can see the rest of the scrapyard.
I have of course now got the screen cap of Dean leaning against the Impala, and the close up of his hard stare, one eyebrow quirked...I shall have to look again (what a hardship!) to see the shot you were talking about between the cell bars...
But when I watch again, I think I am going to get more of the emotion each time; I feel this one is going to grow on me.
Oh and the fact they are out of order, I'd read that somewhere else and that actually helps to know - hopefully when they bring out the DVDs they will correct that, but even if they don't, I am going to reorder my copies so when I rewatch the series I will rewatch the right way round!
gaelicspirit
Mar. 30th, 2010 05:04 pm (UTC)
Y'know... the funny thing is, I haven't re-watched a single episode (during the season, I mean) since S2. Once I get the DVDs, sure I watch them then, but I don't go back while the season is running to re-watch.

I'm not sure why that is. I can think of 100 excuses -- not enough time being one of them -- but I actually, honestly, don't want to until I know how the season's going to end.

It's okay, you can say it. I know I'm weird.

Then I picked up the parallel with Heart where Dean was clearly willing to take the burden of killing for Bobby [...] just as he had with Sam and Maddison and that was very sad.

This is so, so true. I mean even though in retrospect Dean saw that both men had to do this on their own, he was willing to take on that pain just to spare them from it. And it broke him. Perhaps not in the same way as Sam and Bobby, but just as bad. *sniff*

I have of course now got the screen cap of Dean leaning against the Impala, and the close up of his hard stare, one eyebrow quirked...

*grabby hands* You willing to share? :) Yeah, that and the shot through the bars while in jail are two that had me going "YUM."

Thank you for coming by and taking time to comment! :) See you later,
G

amber1960
Mar. 30th, 2010 09:54 pm (UTC)
Happy to share screen caps and do requests too!! Not sure of the best way to do it - thinks...I have a website I could invite you to be a member of where I am posting nice pictures I find and it stores them in high res...I'm thinking of that instead of emailing as I sometimes have problems sending large files - and instead of LJ as I haven't worked out how to do stuff on there yet. What do you think?
gaelicspirit
Mar. 30th, 2010 11:12 pm (UTC)
If you're okay inviting me, I'd love to see. :)
jazzyirish
Mar. 30th, 2010 07:36 pm (UTC)
Hi Gaelic! Better late than never, as they say. Loved your ramble and enthusiasm to have the boys back. I agree - somehow this shorter hellatus seemed longer than the previous one. Anyway, they're baaackkk!

And back they are. I really enjoyed this episode. Jeremy Carver definitely is at his best when writing about personal relationships - usually between the boys, but also any "family". My heart broke for Bobby - I can't imagine what it would be like to have deceased love ones back in my life for a "visit" knowing they would be taken away again. :(

I must also say that I love this new director - he's a keeper. Love those close-ups of our beautiful boys and great transition shots. The whole episode felt so fresh. That one shot of Dean standing by the car in Bobby's junk yard watching the house with the zoom-in to a close-up - just WOW!

Regarding Bobby being the town drunk, I suspect he was for a very long time after he had to kill (think of all the liquor bottles we saw after Dean went to hell). As he became a demon hunter, it continued to be a good cover.

I thought Dean was fantastic in this from his quirks to his very sincere concern/protectiveness for Bobby both when Karen was there and after she was gone again. Word is that this episode was supposed to air before MBV, and it would make more sense to see Dean feel like he's lost everyone (even Bobby who seems broken) and needs help from God because there's no one else to help him down here. :(

Loved the great action scenes with the zombies in the junk yard and in Bobby's house. I'm not sure that Bobby told the boys the complete message from Death, though. I don't see Bobby as the one who is keeping Sam from saying "yes" to Luci, although Sam would not want to disappoint Bobby (or Dean) again. And I'm with you about Bobby not making it through the season, but that would be the greatest loss since BDW, in my opinion. And I'm not sure that Dean could handle another loss of another "father". Let's hope it doesn't come to that.

Well, I'm really looking forward to next week's episode - and, of course, your ramble. Catch ya' then.

Irish
gaelicspirit
Mar. 30th, 2010 07:54 pm (UTC)
There's a line in Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring that I think aptly applies to the Irish as well -- both those by birth and those by spirit: A wizard is never late. Nor is he early. He arrives precisely when he means to.

And here you are. :)

You're so right -- had we seen these in the order in which the writers apparently intended, Dean's plea would have been that much more poignant and necessary. But we're a clever lot. We can turn it around in our heads, yeah?

I don't see Bobby as the one who is keeping Sam from saying "yes" to Luci, although Sam would not want to disappoint Bobby (or Dean) again...

I've only seen it the one time, but I think that Bobby said he was one of the reasons Sam hadn't said yes to Lucifer (with a 'yet' implied). I think that could be true -- Dean is one BIG reason as is Sam's one (very large) sense of pride and need to Make Things Better after he (as he sees it) started the apocalypse. But I think taht both boys see Bobby as a father-figure in their own ways (Dean moreso for a plethora of reasons) and I think that Sam has so many hang-ups with the way his relationship with John spun out there before the end that he would do just about anything to NOT disappoint Bobby.

And I'm not sure that Dean could handle another loss of another "father". Let's hope it doesn't come to that.

Agree on so many different levels. They worry me with their vague implications. Darn boys!

Thank you for coming by -- I've missed you! I hope to see you on a review page sometime in the near future...if RL lets me get one of the two stories I'm working on actually written... :)

Slainte!
tuya_moon
Mar. 31st, 2010 04:25 am (UTC)
Ok, FINALLY saw the episode! LA was good, but I was really missing my boys. Geez, it's a wonder I didn't like totally go into SPN withdrawl/comatose after having to wait nearly a week! But, hey, life happens. Well, I gotta go to bed, but now I am finally clear read your ramble without getting spoiled! Will read/comment tomorrah! :)
gaelicspirit
Mar. 31st, 2010 10:47 pm (UTC)
Welcome home! Look forward to hearing from you.
marlowe78
Mar. 31st, 2010 12:10 pm (UTC)
Thanks again for writing a synopsis - makes it easier to remember.
I never knew they changed the episodes around, which made me all angry that there was NOTHING from MBV. But ok, at least this way, it makes sense. Also, why Bobby wasn't there when the detoxed Sam. Too much for Bobby Singer *sigh*
Poor man.
I'm pretty sure they asked Jim Beaver about what he can act. I don't know, but I have the feeling this was written only for Bobby - and therefore for Jim. And considering that Jensen, for his performance in All Hell breaks loose II got a screened partition of the set to not be bothered by others, only a camera and Kim Manners, than I'm pretty certain they wouldn't do less for Jim. Ok, it's not Manners, but...manners, right?

What I distinctly disliked was the lack of reaction from Dean to the scratched-open coffin in the cemetery. Because... come on. They could include this little titbit of true PTSD for Dean, it wouldn't even take much time. Just a little facial expression. But no, not even a flinch. Why didn't they? This coffin was CREEPY!
And while we're at it: how about a strange look to Dean when he says "They were DEAD" - you know, a hint: "so, you were too. And you're not turned, are you???" I'd have liked that. More angst.

Now, reading your synopsis, I suddenly understand why Sam could be so quick at Singers Salvage: all zombies were THERE, not in town. Ha! So, that's why there are so many: all of them came to Bobby and Dean. Would be about the right amount of dead-guys.

To the Zombie-Problem (aka: how to kill'em): How about the Zombie-Chick was resurrected by a Greek spell, these here were different? Dunno, just a suggestion. But you're right, it doesn't add up, sadly. But it'll be SO hard to nail 18 Zombies into their graves :-D
Why wasn't Rumsfeld there? I'd have liked a Zombie-Dog. *sigh* Maybe too much for Bobby: first his wife, then his dog... like kicking a man when he's already down.

I wondered a bit about Sam. He was... like s2 Sam. A little harder, but he HAD to kill the kid (and boy, did I weep for that poor Sheriff, she did lose her son TWICE and now her husband too...). He's... detached, and yet strangely, naively hopeful: "but you'll be ok?" I mean... ow can he be? SAM went off the rails when Dean died, and Bobby had to kill his wife TWICE. How can anyone be ok after that? Dean at least didn't ask that, he knew. So, what's this with Sam? Maybe it's because he didn't have to go through detox?
See, I've always had this idea that Sam was like he was from the start of s5, because he was *fingersnip* suddenly clean. No detox, no horror, he didn't have to FIGHT for being ok again. So, I've always thought he'd never get Dean, his loss of hope and the depth of despair, because in a way, he was let off the hook too easily. He'd always been let off a little easily, in my opinion. Except for Jess, of course. And Dean's death. But, you know, nearly EVERY time he slipped because HE made a mistake, Dean caught him, helped him up. So, I hope the detox from the previous-really-this episode will make him clean not only physically, but mentally too. He has to FIGHT, dig his nails in, hang on. Survive.

Knowing they mixed the episodes up makes "Dead men don't wear plaids" a little less unbearable. Knowing it was supposed to come first... well, I can understand why it didn't refer to anything from MBV.

BUT: What.The.Hell????

This was really a stupid, stupid mistake, and I sure hope they won't do it again. Made me real, real disappointed while watching. Couldn't even enjoy all the gore :-(

Catch ya next ep (Friday? I can't stay up that long on Thursday ;-))
gaelicspirit
Mar. 31st, 2010 10:47 pm (UTC)
They could include this little titbit of true PTSD for Dean, it wouldn't even take much time. Just a little facial expression. But no, not even a flinch. Why didn't they? This coffin was CREEPY!

OMG so TRUE! I will admit my mind didn't go there because I was focused on Bobby (which is where the writers probably wanted us to be so that we missed things like this) but YOU, my friend were too clever!!

I wonder, though, if we might get some more PTSD-ness from Dean as we draw closer to the end of the season and a showdown between our heroes, their souls, and the angels/devils vying for them.

But you're right, it doesn't add up, sadly. But it'll be SO hard to nail 18 Zombies into their graves :-D

I just wish that somewhere in the dialog they would have made the connection that our assumption is right and shown us how the boys knew.

Y'know, like perhaps... at the cemetery, when they dug up Clay's empty grave? For example:

*ahem*

Dean: Something stinks.

Sam: Well, it's not Clay Thompson, because he's gone.

Dean: You thinking zombie?

Sam: What else could it be?

Dean: (sighing) Swell. We have to find a way to get this guy back to his grave and stake him in it. Gonna be a fun night.

Sam: There is lore out there that says a headshot'll do the trick.

Dean: 'Cause that worked so well with Angela. She tackled you like a high-school fullback after taking a bullet to the forehead.

(helping to explain why Dean pulls his gun as they lead DeadClay out into the street)

>>Later, at Roy's Diner, after Bobby reveals that DEATH is behind this.

Dean: No way are we getting twenty people back to twenty graves...

Sam: So...headshot?

Dean: We got a choice?

Sam: Well, it wasn't necromancy that rejuvenated these bodies. It was a horseman. I'm thinking lore has to be rewritten.

Dean: (nodding) Desperate times, desperate measures.

*aaaannnnd scene*

Maybe it's because he didn't have to go through detox?
See, I've always had this idea that Sam was like he was from the start of s5, because he was *fingersnip* suddenly clean. No detox, no horror, he didn't have to FIGHT for being ok again.


This is a really good point and one I'll probably think about for awhile. Because as the saying goes, anything worth having is worth fighting for. And Lord knows Dean has had to fight every step of the way. He's fought so long and hard he's had to ask for help.

But Sam... though he has been through detox (twice, now) that one time returning him to normal could have had an effect of... well, taking it for granted.

Like I said... I'll have to think on that one. :)

Thanks for coming by!!
marlowe78
Apr. 1st, 2010 06:17 pm (UTC)
Y'know, like perhaps... at the cemetery, when they dug up Clay's empty grave? For example:

*ahem*

Dean: Something stinks.

Sam: Well, it's not Clay Thompson, because he's gone.

Dean: You thinking zombie?

Sam: What else could it be?

Dean: (sighing) Swell. We have to find a way to get this guy back to his grave and stake him in it. Gonna be a fun night.

Sam: There is lore out there that says a headshot'll do the trick.

Dean: 'Cause that worked so well with Angela. She tackled you like a high-school fullback after taking a bullet to the forehead.

(helping to explain why Dean pulls his gun as they lead DeadClay out into the street)

>>Later, at Roy's Diner, after Bobby reveals that DEATH is behind this.

Dean: No way are we getting twenty people back to twenty graves...

Sam: So...headshot?

Dean: We got a choice?

Sam: Well, it wasn't necromancy that rejuvenated these bodies. It was a horseman. I'm thinking lore has to be rewritten.

Dean: (nodding) Desperate times, desperate measures.

*aaaannnnd scene*


See? That there? That's the reason why Kripke and his minions should ask one of the fanfic-writers to write a script.
Mind, of course, one who wouldn't fuck them up too much, all bloody and hurt. Or make them cuddle. Or whatever. But, you know... a responsible person. Over 16 preferably. *g*
I could name a few who'd totally be able to, you'd be among them for sure. (I'm still not over the great work you did with "Wearing and tearing")

Sometimes I think... well, I'm not sure what I think, but WE wouldn't have let so many opportunities slip away. Or make mistakes like that. AND some of "us" could find a great plot, even one that'd fit in 40 minutes. We totally would do it just for food, a bed and travel-expanses, right?? (I would...)

arafel979
Apr. 1st, 2010 03:51 pm (UTC)
Hey Gaelic-fighting sickness, but I simply HAD to jump on quick before tonight's new ep to let you know I read, and as usual, loved your words.
I think it was very obvious that this one was supposed to come before MBV, and I wish they could have fit it in that way as the lack of continuity REALLY bugged me on this one. And I know that they've done this a couple of times before but, to me, more seamlessly-this time it was glaring, IMO. But that aside, I thought it was a better stand-alone than most we've gotten this season. I've lost it some for Bobby since the end of S4, mostly due to the writing-their making him more a crotchety old man, surrogate father figure, than a caring(notice I put this first), crotchety old man, surrogate father figure being the main reason. And for that reason, the BobbyAngst didn't get to me as much as it probably would have a couple of seasons ago. I CAN appreciate how hard this must have been for JB, though. I thought his best scene was when he was talking about his dead wife humming while she cooked. And I LOVED the look he exchanged with Dean after having to kill her-the looks on both of their faces owned that scene, IMO. Awesome.
As usual, it was The Dean who kept me glued to the screen, though. This new director did a wonderful job. His close-ups reminded me of Kim Manners way of shooting the guys and Jensen!-JUST GUH!!!-through-out the entire episode! Loved that this director seemed to realize, like Kim, exactly how the camera truly loves our guy-his waiting in full-on hunter mode while leaning against the Impala has become one of the most buzzed about shots of the ep-absolutely gorgeous. I loved the grave-digging scene, too-the whole thing from when they first start looking around with their flashlights to the straight cut from the shovel going into the ground to Sam in the grave with Dean looking down at him from that sexy squat position of his(and how ON EARTH! does he make that position look SO. DAMNED. SEXY. Gotta love the man, eh?!)
Loved that Dean FINALLY got to EAT his pie! And those two scenes were also probably my favorites of the ep.
The coughing, phlegmy Ezra Jones/Sam scene was probably the grossest-and I only say probably because it made me cringe just a tiny bit more than the dead kid advancing on his mother while holding his father's intestines. Ew. They really brought the gore in these last two, didn't they? Kripke must have love watching those! :)



arafel979
Apr. 1st, 2010 03:55 pm (UTC)
Part 2
"About five seconds after they split up, Dean is jumped by DeadClay and in a weird flurry of confused confession, we find out that yes, he is DeadClay, yes, he killed Ben Sutton (but only because Sutton killed him you see) and that he doesn’t know exactly what he is… Clay’s wife (very much not dead) comes around the corner and the boys cover with their FBI persona’s and take Clay outside."

I LOVED the humor here.

"Dean pulls his gun and Sam stops him.

Dean: He’s a monster.

Sam: He’s a…soccer Dad.

I get that it’s confusing, but I gotta side with Dean on this one. I mean, yeah, DeadClay didn’t act like a brain-sucking monster, but still. He. Was. Dead. And walking around. And dead. With all the apocolyptic crap going on, soccer dad or no, when it comes to that kind of stuff? Unless they’re angels, I think Dean’s instinctual black/white approach trumps Sam’s shades of gray. However, they don’t get a chance to get into a debate about it because Sheriff Mills shows up and cuffs them.

Dean’s all, hey, this is the dead guy you said couldn’t have possible killed that guy. Sheriff Mills doesn’t care who he is or what he did; Dean can’t take him out and shoot him in the street (because that would be Very Wrong). Hilariously, DeadClay is indignant about how he was about to meet his 2nd demise and the boys are hauled away with understandably baffled expressions."

I never understand this kind of stuff-were we supposed to see Dean as wrong there?-because I'm with you and him on this one. I just see this kind of scene as Dean in full-on hunter mode, which he was in for the entire ep(and I gotta say, YOWZA! when he's like this...*winks*), and I guess we were supposed to see Sam's as the voice of "reason" there? Or perhaps, maybe they were going for Dean being a little too trigger-happy in his wanting to do it in the middle of the street, right there. I don't know, it kind of just didn't seem to fit to me especially as a few scenes later we get Sam agreeing with Dean when they have that sit-down with Bobby...*shrugs*...

"In the cell, they try to hash out what the hell is going on: Sheriff on the take? Zombies paying her off? Total aside: there’s a profile shot of Dean through the bars of the jail cell…he’s sitting, looking down, pensive expression on his face, then glances up through the bars toward the main room and…guh. Something about the lighting, his expression…it was just…very nice."

So. Much. Agreement. Like I said, he always looks good, but he sometimes has these episodes, where every scene he's in, even every single shot of him just leaves me kind of breathless-Dead in the Water, Something Wicked, DT, IMTOD, The Usual Suspects, Children Shouldn't Play with Dead Things, WIAWSNB-and that's only through S2!-but you get the idea, right? This was another one of those, IMHO. You know, I think I'm going to make myself a nice cup of tea and watch this one again...right now! LOL! Keep on streaming for us, girlfriend! Tonight's episode looks awesome. Hopefully they will kick the Apocalypse into high gear. 'Til next time! *hugs*


gaelicspirit
Apr. 2nd, 2010 01:30 pm (UTC)
Re: Part 2
I'm replying to all of your comments here. :) I'm sorry I didn't get to this before last night's heartbreaker of an episode, but I just ran out of time. Work is...well, work these days. LOL!

I hope you're feeling better! It's so hard to be sick when you have so much to do. :( I'm sending you lots of light out into the world. And I want you to know that even if you save this for last -- meaning comment right before the next episode -- I'm happy that you come here, read, and comment. Seeing you makes me happy and your thoughts are always insightful and welcome.

I think I felt the juxtaposition of the episode even more keenly after seeing "Dark Side of the Moon"... it would have been a good follow up from Dean's heartfelt plea to Heaven. But, whatever. We can't control everything.

I think the reason I felt so much for Bobby in this wasn't because of how the episode was written, but the spin I put on it myself. I really connected with Jim's book--his honesty put into perspective some of the things I deal with on a daily basis being married to a man with a chronic disease--and so I was more connecting to JIM, really, than BOBBY... but it worked to suck me in to the storyline and allow me to forgive the randomosity that ran amuck with the writing.

Not that I'm a fantastic writer--I'm not; I'm merely a storyteller--but I could have done a much better job than that with the zombies.

were we supposed to see Dean as wrong there?-because I'm with you and him on this one. I just see this kind of scene as Dean in full-on hunter mode, which he was in for the entire ep(and I gotta say, YOWZA! when he's like this...*winks*), and I guess we were supposed to see Sam's as the voice of "reason" there? Or perhaps, maybe they were going for Dean being a little too trigger-happy in his wanting to do it in the middle of the street, right there. I don't know, it kind of just didn't seem to fit to me especially as a few scenes later we get Sam agreeing with Dean when they have that sit-down with Bobby...*shrugs*...

Totally agree... I wasn't sure what the point of that was EXCEPT maybe to show the brothers at odds. But...duh. Nothing new there.

while I got the point that Death wanted Bobby out of the way because he's a part of Team Free Will-the writing of that last scene just seemed very off to me in many ways-the dialogue mostly. No time to go into it in depth, but it almost seemed as if it came out of left field because they're setting something up with Bobby...

That did seem rushed -- and I didn't like how they just shoved in that Bobby was one of the reasons Sam was saying no to Lucifer. What about one of the reasons Dean was saying no to Michael? What about being part of a family unit? It was another place I didn't get what they were trying to show us.

But I DO think they're setting something up for Bobby. And even after the heartbreak of last night, I think that taking Bobby away will trigger a fallout like Heaven is NOT prepared for when it comes to our boy.

Thank you so much for taking time to read and comment.

See you soon!

(Anonymous)
Apr. 1st, 2010 04:07 pm (UTC)
I guess I should have added that while I got the point that Death wanted Bobby out of the way because he's a part of Team Free Will-the writing of that last scene just seemed very off to me in many ways-the dialogue mostly. No time to go into it in depth, but it almost seemed as if it came out of left field because they're setting something up with Bobby...not sure though. I guess we'll see. :)
arafel979
Apr. 1st, 2010 05:27 pm (UTC)
UGH! Anonymous above is me, too...*blushes*...
looselyspeaking
Apr. 10th, 2010 12:28 pm (UTC)
I watched this very slowly due to download probs over about two hours, very unsatisfactory, but I got there in the end. Will have to rewatch when a more decent copy comes onto surfthechannel, but at least I had your lovely ramble and there's no annoying 'page refreshing' to stop me enjoying this!

I agree with you totally that both Bobby and Dean looked worn down and Sam still seems very up and not so affected. It makes me wonder how much more Dean can take, he seems fragile and I feel that the road ahead is going to be too much for him, unless, he gets help from somewhere else. Maybe upstairs, wouldn't be too much to ask for now would it?

Okies, off to watch the next one, hopefully without it stopping a zillion times.

Thanks for a delicious ramble, muchly enjoyed.

gaelicspirit
Apr. 10th, 2010 01:16 pm (UTC)
Oh, how frustrating! I am counting my blessings that I have it on my DVR, no down-time waits!

Thanks for reading...and hang on as you go throug the next couple. The fragility is palpable. *sniff*

See you soon!
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