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Stream of Consciousness, Epi 10.17

Okay, I liked this one, you guys. I know - you're shocked, right? ;)



I have, in the past, been accused (either lovingly or derisively so) of being terminally positive when it comes to our Show. Which I take both as a compliment and exception to. I mean, yes, I tend to head for the sunny side of the street -- I like seeing the good in things -- but I believe I've also made more than a half-way decent attempt to call a spade a spade when they've lost the plot, gone off the map, or made me hand wave and tilt my head so much I look like a 19th century corseted woman with the vapors.

So, when I say I enjoyed this episode -- even with the Rowena scenes -- you know it's genuine. *smiles*

I'm going to work from what I'd consider the top of the Triangle of Like down -- the bottom being the OMG I loved that level. Let's start with Rowena (though my automatic lip-snarl when it comes to Metatron makes his story a fierce contender for top of the Triangle of Like...as it is, he barely deserves a passing mention). Thus far this season when the scene shifted away from the boys to the Hellish Queen Mother I would sigh and allow my attention to waver a bit. But in Inside Man, her story (finally) started to converge with the brothers' story. AND I loved how her continuously duplicitous nature pushed her son over the edge of choosing a side. It's ironic, isn't it, that Crowley once bellowed the demand to Dean to choose a side when he wasn't really able to do so himself until he had a heart-to-heart with Dean about family?

But the thing that I find the most compelling about her story right now is the way she reacted to the news that Dean bore the Mark of Cain. She barely flinched. It was more of a relief, it seemed, to have a viable reason for her blood-sigil spell not working on Dean. She simply shrugged and said that it was just a curse -- the first curse, sure, but still just a curse. And it could be removed. But, her initial catalyst for figuring out how to get rid of the Mark was to kill Dean and remove his influence from Crowley's life. But now that Crowley has kicked her out of Hell (and how's that gonna look on her resume, huh? "Kicked out of Hell by son."), will she no longer care about eliminating Dean? Or will she now care MORE about it? We've already seen that she's a pretty firm believer in the healing powers of revenge...she's now got an axe to grind against both Dean for "poisoning" Crowley against her and Crowley for kicking her out.

I think it would be rather compelling if the solution to the Mark of Cain came from the mother of the King of Hell. After all, the curse originated from the former ruler of Hell. And we've already established that Metatron is a lying liar who lies. Actually, I can't decide if he's lying about lying about knowing anything about the Mark, or if he's telling the truth about lying about knowing anything about the Mark. O_o

Either way, I've currently more trust in the King of Hell than the Scribe of God. And if that's not sideways, I don't know what is.

Moving down the triangle (it's a pretty short, fat triangle), is the whole secretive Mission: Impossible efforts between Cas and Sam. Cas' sweet-faced expressions of worry when it came to Dean's situation juxtaposed to his hard-eyed determination when confronted with Metatron were satisfying to see. I loved, too, how quickly they were able to shift to a Plan B when boy-Hannah denied Castiel entrance into Heaven. I was a little worried about the seance scene since the last time one was attempted involving Cas, the medium's eyes were burned out, but doing so with the mind-reading atheist was nicely effective. I applauded their double-cross of Metatron when he confessed to lying about the "river ending at the source" (or was he??). I toooootally did not see the whole grace-theft coming. That was awesome. And now, it seems, that Metatron is no longer a viable contender for providing a solution to the Mark, but if he can help get Cas' grace back, as Darth Vader might say, "He may yet be of some use to us." I want Cas to be whole and healthy and grace-filled.

Down further still was Bobby. I miss that character. I miss his orneriness and how he provided stability to both boys in a way their own father hadn't been able to. I miss the way he'd knock their heads together and provide some wisdom -- often at the same time. I loved his private Heaven, feet up, sippin' whiskey, listening to Kenny Rogers, reading about Tori Spelling (I forgot he always had a thing for her). I loved that he was ready to step away from that in a heartbeat if it meant helping his boys. I loved his craftiness of instigating a soul revolt of the 'S' portion of Heavenly doors. And I loved his scenes with Cas -- his exasperation and understanding wrapped up in one grumpy frown. The letter he wrote Sam, though, was perfection. Sam needed that. Needed to hear that Bobby was proud of him, that he understood what he was doing, but also that he needed to stop this behind-Dean's-back crap before it got out of hand. I love that Bobby knows Dean so well that he can advise Sam in how to find his balance once more.

I only wish we knew what happened to him when those angels wandered into his Heaven -- will he be put into Heaven's jail? Kicked out completely?? And will they tie up that thread at some point or will we just have to torturously wonder as to his ultimate fate? *yipe*

That brings me to our favorite little brother. I have to say, I am loving Sam this season. I've always been a 'Dean-girl' but have also claimed from the start that Dean wouldn't be the Dean I love were it not for Sam (and then Dean had to go and echo that with his there ain't no me if there ain't no you plea). I love how his story is focused on saving his brother while also showing him different aspects of himself and his personality that he hasn't taken time to explore in a long while (being distracted as he was by nearly dying from the Trials and being possessed by an angel). I love absorbing his devotion and his tenacity and the way he wholly believes in certain people but isn't afraid to get his hands dirty. And I love, too, the vulnerability and loneliness he exposes when confronted with the near-impossibility of his quest.

The absolute panic on his face shifting to a helpless, empathetic pain when he was woken by Dean's frightened cry and then stood in witness to his brother's torment in the nightmare made me rub my heart. The fic-writer in me wanted him to go wake Dean and offer him words of comfort, but I understood why he didn't. Especially when Dean acted like nothing happened the next morning. Sam knows his brother well enough that if he were to call attention to the pain Dean was in, it would make Dean uncomfortable, withdrawn, and in all probability a bit surly in an effort to keep Sam from getting too close. It would be Dean's dual protection mode: protect himself from the pain of recognized vulnerability and protect Sam from whatever he might be capable of.

I love that Sam was not giving up on finding a way to save his brother -- to the point of doing a little bad for the sake of a bigger good. And most of all, I loved the look of longing -- for answers, for stability, for his brother to be okay, for Bobby to be back, for all of it together -- that crossed his face as he read Bobby's letter. *rubs heart*

And finally, the base of the triangle: Dean. I am really enjoying the complexity of his storyline right now. I love how at first we were like, wait, that's it? when he was de-demonized so early in the season, but then realized that his being a demon was just the tip of the iceberg. It's the continuing story of Dean's humanity that is driving him -- it's always been about his humanity, I now realize. For so long, it was the fact that he was the only one who'd maintained his humanity as a state of being when others were possessed or had powers or what have you. And now, it's about maintaining his humanity as a state of mind in the wake of death and demon-ization.

The beginning with his nightmare (and seriously, folks, the little h/c junkie inside me was doing backflips in my belly...how many times have I/we written a scene like that???) with that tormented voice crying out in both pain and fear, calling for Sam in the same way he did when trapped on the meat hooks in Hell, just...the whole way the Mark is torturing him at a level he refuses to outwardly recognize for the subconscious worry of giving it too much power is completely captivating to me. He fights to maintain a composed, 'regular Dean' facade -- giving his brother a hard time, looking for hunts, noshing on some (awesome looking) nachos, hustling pool -- while inside he's fighting a constant, exhausting battle.

Last week, we heard his confession that he wasn't ready to die. Having already died and having seen the worst side of himself (as a demon), he's finding himself wanting to explore the possibility of a life beyond the hunt. Beyond day after day of wading hip-deep in death and dying and killing and darkness. So now he's faced with overwhelming internal confrontation of his declaration that he is going to fight the Mark until he can't anymore and then he'll give in warring with his true desire to be the hero Rowena pinned him as, be the good guy, and live a life he's never before really considered a possibility. The way he forced himself to not kill the college kids that Rowena had put under an attack spell, and the way he sat down, like a battle-weary soldier, to talk with Crowley, just showcased the ever-present, ongoing fight that is tormenting his spirit and compelling his brother to find a way -- any way -- to save him.

I loved what he said about family so much I want to make it a Facebook status. In fact, I still may. It's what has defined this show, these brothers, from the start. It poetically echoed Bobby's words (and of course Dean would have no way of knowing how poignant that would be in that moment), and it showed that the Dean that cared nothing about people and life and the impacts of his actions when he was a demon is not the true Dean. Not even close.

"Family don't end in blood, but it doesn't start there, either. Family cares about you. Not what you can do for them. Family is there. Through the good, bad, all of it. They've got your back even when it hurts. That's family."

I have many things to include in my lists; I would love to know your lists as well. But first as a quickie note: it looks like we're skipping next week (April 8th) and returning the following Wednesday (April 15th). Mark your calendars.

LIKES:

  • Sam instantly on alert, gun in hand, roaming the hallway the second Dean's cry of pain and fear wakes him. Aside: it made me wonder a bit how much of a subconscious mental shift they had to make when they moved to the bunker and picked separate rooms. Spending so many years sharing hotel rooms, getting used to the sound of each other's sleep, it had to have been difficult at first to learn how to sleep again.

  • The sound of Dean's voice -- the fear and pain and panic captured in the tone -- when he cried out, "SAM!"

  • Pretty much the whole nightmare. I know! I know, but I can't help it. SEEING the Mark affect him like that, even through a rough nightmare, is so much more satisfying than just hearing that it is affecting him.

  • Dean in that red shirt. I think I need to say that one again. Dean. In that red shirt. *bites lip*

  • The Winchesters having a Snow Day.

  • "I say we get drunk and shoot crap." "We do that every day." Aside: really? They get drunk every day? Hmmm....

  • "I trust you. Make good choices." Well, someone's seen Pitch Perfect.

  • "Stay outta my room." And Dean subsequently disobeying and setting up every annoying brother booby trap in Sam's room as soon as Sam left.

  • Cas' worried expression when Sam says that Dean is getting worse and they have to do something because nothing else is working.

  • "Please stop talking."

  • Product placement in Hell. Microsoft must be so proud.

  • Dean being on a first name basis with the local bartender. To me, that means they've been in one place long enough to know the locals. They've sorta put down roots.

  • The way Dean messed up his hair to look wasted in order to hustle the 'Abercrombie reject' college kids. Seriously, folks. That was one of those OMG I loved that bottom of the triangle moments.

  • "I'll break it down." "Dude, Dude, Dude. Chill." "I'm helping!"

  • "I'm an angel." "You can't be!" "Why not?" "Because I'm an atheist." "Not anymore" (Bonus points for Sam's little smirk.)

  • Metatron being referred to as both a Hobbit and a Fraggle in one episode.

  • Dean hustling pool again. I mean, we know they did it because they told us, but I think this might be one of the few (if not only) times where we've gotten to actually watch him in action, going from the soused sucker losing every shot to the cool, controlled master who doesn't even give the other guy a moment to take a breath.

  • Bobby's hat. *rubs heart*

  • Rowena using Crowley's greeting with the college boys.

  • The startled reaction from Dean when he catches a glimpse of the (real or imagined?) flash of black demon eyes in the mirror.

  • "You remember when this job was just chopping up some fang & tossing back a cold one?" "I miss that." Yeah. Me too, actually.

  • Bobby referring to himself as Steve McQueen. I <3 Steve McQueen and The Great Escape was one of his best movies.

  • "Did I say nice girl?  I meant evil skank." "You say that like it's an insult."

  • Dean's fight -- both physical and internal -- with the cursed college boys, followed by Rowena challenging the hero in him: save them, or kill her.

  • "Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in." Nice Godfather shout-out, Bobby.

  • "Balls!" Because of the reason.

  • Crowley's blase, "Rough date, mother?"

  • "He's Bobby. He can handle anything."

  • The fact that I thought when Dean said, "We gonna do this," to Crowley we were going to see a fight and we ended up seeing two guys having a heart-to-heart over drinks.

  • Door #42. Oh, how I love clever writers. Thank you, Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, for providing us with the Answer to the Ultimate Question of Life, The Universe, and Everything.

  • "Welcome to the party." I wish wish wish Bobby would have channeled Die Hard's John McClain and added a 'pal' at the end of that line. *smiles*

  • The irony of Crowley calling Dean out for being a lying liar who lies.

  • Crowley's umbrella drink.

  • "I'm playing Dr. Phil to the King of Hell. Never saw that coming." "Maybe we're getting old." "Never saw that coming, either."

  • The whole speech about family (see above).

  • "You're gonna be my punching bag."

  • Sam and Cas turning the leverage tables on Metatron and their smug expressions when they threw his own smarmy words back in his face.

  • "I'm choosing me." Never thought I'd say it, but good for you, Crowley.

  • "I'm bloody CROWLEY! The King of Hell! I do what I want when I want!" And apparently, what he wants is to not kill our boys at the moment, so I'm okay with that. Even if he's more of a pet at the moment than a scary demon.

  • Sam reading Bobby's letter. And everything the letter said. In particular: "You're a good man, Sam Winchester. One of the best. I'm proud of you." And, "Kick it in the ass." *sniff*

NOT SO MUCH:

  • Anyone else think this episode's "THEN" was waaaay too long? I mean, if you have to show that much of the previous episodes for people to get where we are in the story, maybe your overall plotting could use a bit of tightening up, yeah? And what was with all the close-ups of Rowena's face? That was...awkward. Unless they are subliminally telling us that she is the key to all of this. *shrug*

  • The angels not letting Cas into Heaven at all. I mean, sure I get that they don't want him to break out Metatron, but not to let him in at all? *frowns*

  • Dean not giving the college kid's watch back. Yes, it's consistent with the hustles he would have run in the past, and yes, the kid didn't have to bet it in the first place, but it made me sad that they added that bit about it having been a gift from his dad and Dean didn't need the watch. Oh, well, at least he saved the kid's life in the end. That's worth more than a watch.

  • The fact that Metatron lied about the "River will end at the source" line. Or at least claimed that he did. Hrm.

  • Sam getting the jump on the one angel protecting the Door to Heaven, and then having enough time for them to de-grace Metatron when before, four angels emerged from the woodwork (literally) to stop Cas from going topside.

  • Not knowing Bobby's fate when the angels came into his private Heaven. *worried*

BURNING QUESTIONS:

  • All right, show of hands, who thinks Metatron is lying about not knowing anything concerning the Mark? I mean, really? He wrote down everything God said from the beginning of time. Was he really making that river line up?

  • I've really gotta wonder if they are going to have to bring Lucifer into this whole thing at some point. I think it would be an excellent cliffhanger if Rowena decided that she was going to figure out how to remove the curse just so she could kill Dean and get revenge on her betrayer of a son, and the solution she discovers somehow triggers bringing Lucifer from the cage -- potentially leaving us with a de-Marked Dean (who would then be once more fully human and vulnerable) and Lucifer (and possibly Michael) running amuck as the S11 arc. I've kind of given up on the idea that they'll ever go back to the "simple" saving people, hunting things days of yore.

  • More of a hopefully musing than a burning question, but, I wonder if Sam will tell Dean what he and Cas did and show him the letter. One would think that at some point -- if the roadtrip to get Cas' grace back is successful -- he'll have to, right?

Thanks for reading, you guys. And apologies in advance for any typos, misspellings, or incorrect homophone uses that catch your eye. These never get a second-party edit, and with my schedule as it is these days, I'm totally multitasking on work tasks and meetings just to get them written and posted as soon after the episode as I can. Not that that's a good excuse, but it's the only one I've got at the moment. *smile*

Hope to hear from you!

Slainte!

Comments

( 58 Tall Tales — Tell Me A Story )
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primrose_1
Apr. 2nd, 2015 08:30 pm (UTC)
I have ALWAYS had a soft spot for Bobby, and just seeing him made me want to cry! His letter at the end was so wonderful! I've never been a fan of the show's version of Heaven and I think Bobby pinpointed it when he said, "I've been content, but this is the happiest I've been in a long time" Aww!

I also REALLY loved Crowley and Dean's talk. The relationship with Crowley is something I am really loving.

SO HAPPY!!

Julie
gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:19 am (UTC)
I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. Thank you for reading and for commenting and for being HAPPY!!! YAY!

I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :)
sw0rdy
Apr. 2nd, 2015 09:06 pm (UTC)
I've just watched it and AMEN to everything you've said. This was a fantastic episode and, like you, I actually didn't mind the Rowena / angels parts this time. There were some brilliant lines (you've pointed them out) and the H/C junkie in me had to go back and watch Dean having his nightmare again and the way he shouted for Sam. Plus Dean hustling pool was seriously hot! This was a really good one and I loved every second.

On a more general note, I LOVE your positivity. It reminds me (happily) that there are people out there who love the show in its current form as much as me. There's a site that I discovered when I first got into Supernatural that I used to visit daily but now I can't bear the place because the people who comment there are so vitriolic. Even the promotional photos for an episode unleash a tirade of abuse against Carver, the writers and even the characters. The show's not perfect by any means, but it's still good and I look forward to it every week. It can be hard to enjoy it in the face of such constant negativity, so your rambles are a perfect antidote. Thank you for sharing them.
hunenka
Apr. 2nd, 2015 09:21 pm (UTC)
Sorry for jumping in, but I just have to say how much I agree with your last paragraph. I too have had to withdraw from some places because they became far too negative and critical, and it's so good to know that I can always come here and know that none of that negativity for the sake of negativity will be here.

Sure, the show's quality has gone down a bit (but come on, it's been ten seasons!), but it's still very good and I still care about it immensely, so hearing only bad things about it hurts me a lot.

So this is me thanking gaelicspirit and everyone here for making this friendly, civil, non-vitriolic environment possible.
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hunenka
Apr. 2nd, 2015 09:11 pm (UTC)
A wonderful episode. Aside from the unnecessarily long THEN section (and the MOC/demon!Dean flashbacks - we remember those, show!) there wasn't a dull moment. Which is pretty rare lately.

And we got Dean playing pool. I'll live off of that for a long time and be happy.

I really hope your speculation about Lucifer (and Michael) won't come true though. I think that the longer the antagonists stay on the show, the less scary/dangerous/fun to watch they are, and I wouldn't want that to happen to Lucifer.

About the simple saving people, hunting things days - Jensen said recently at one of the conventions that he'd like to go back to those MOTW episodes too, and that he's spoken with Carver about it and apparently once the show starts nearing the end, they might go back to this good old basic formula. (It's so cute that Jensen loves the classic SPN as much as we do.)
gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:22 am (UTC)
I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :)

Dean playing pool is one of my happy places. :)

I highly doubt my speculation about Lucifer will come true, but with all this conversation about the first curse and whatnot, I can't help but think he'll have to be involved SOMEHOW. I'm curious to see what they do. And I love that Jensen wants the MotW episodes. :) YAY!
borgmama1of5
Apr. 2nd, 2015 09:24 pm (UTC)
I positively loved that BOTH the characters I hate most got their comeuppance in this episode, Metatron and Rowena!

Metatron's reference to Lucifer--red herring or foreshadowing?!?!? Letting Luci out would certainly fulfill the 'Sam going dark' teases that have been coming out...and Rowena pretty clearly is involved in the Mark story from here out--which is pretty scary to think about...

Dean successfully resisted the Mark's pull again with not killing the college kids--why does he see himself as doomed to give in when he keeps winning his fight? (My thought, btw, on Dean taking the watch--I think we were supposed to see that as demon-influence coming out. 'Cause pretty much everyone was upset with Dean doing that.)

Jared said at Seacon that this year's finale is as intense as Swan Song and Jensen also said it's a killer...

...hiding under the covers sucking my thumb...

ETA I also appreciate knowing that you and Hells_half_acre approach the show with wanting to see the good parts...and yeah, sometimes it disappoints, because we know it can do better, but we still appreciate what it can do!


Edited at 2015-04-02 09:32 pm (UTC)
strgazr04
Apr. 3rd, 2015 05:13 am (UTC)
J2 said that? Oh man! I wonder if Cain's theory will come true then. Or maybe close to it? Honestly, I can see Dean going through Crowley and even Cas but the minute he's aimed at Sam... If that does happen, Dean won't be able to live with himself.

SPECULATION AND SPOILERS..........




Looking at Jensen's latest tweet about him writing a personal note for the props people to use in the finale, I kind of wonder if something dramatic will happen, causing Dean to run away. He could think that if he's apart from Sam then he won't be able to kill him. It would almost be like him parting from Sam at the beginning of The End. Who knows. Really I just wish the brothers remembered the life lessons they've learned from earlier seasons. They never seem to carry over. It's always the 23 episode where they realize "oh hey we really are better when we work together. imagine that!".
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freya922
Apr. 2nd, 2015 10:45 pm (UTC)
I so enjoyed your review. I actually love that you are mostly positive, but still able to call it if something is really off because I also LOVE this Show with such devotion. I don't really want to read reviews that nitpick and howl.

This episode was something extra-special, in my opinion. There have been lots of good ones this season, and even the least intriguing had some really wonderful moments, but this one just never quit. You're right - there were fanfic-worthy moments, that nightmare being first and foremost among them! I loved the atheist-psychic - that was awesome. Sam was AMAZING, Bobby broke my freaking heart...and they brought him back in a way that was not contrived and tacky but necessary to the story and cleverly done. Rowena got scarier, and Crowley chose the boys over her...or at least himself over her. I loved it. Every scene.
gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:25 am (UTC)
I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :) I'm saying the same thing to everyone, but I want everyone to know that my scatteredness is so not intentional, I swear!!

And YAY!!! For loving the episode! *grabs you and twirls*
alleysweeper
Apr. 3rd, 2015 01:00 am (UTC)
Loves:

Dean's comeback of 'Boris and Natasha' to Crowley's greeting of 'Squirrel'! ♥

Castiel sliding into Heaven like an in-the-park Home Run.

Dean and Crowley being besties, even if only as frienemies.

Not so much:

The prison-like set-up of Heaven.

end/

I agree with most everything you said. This was a wonderful episode! For once I liked Rowena's character - maybe because her failure was just so rewarding. :)

Rock On!
Alley

ETA...I wasn't bothered by Dean not returning the watch. It was one of those life lessons. Don't bet more than you're willing to lose.


Edited at 2015-04-03 01:25 am (UTC)
gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:26 am (UTC)
I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :)

Castiel sliding into Heaven like an in-the-park Home Run.

YES TO THIS!! That was awesome.


ETA...I wasn't bothered by Dean not returning the watch. It was one of those life lessons. Don't bet more than you're willing to lose.


That's a very good point. It's an important lesson -- and after all, Dean did save the kid's life. :)
impala1967
Apr. 3rd, 2015 04:21 am (UTC)
Hi there Gurl, long time no comment, yeah sorry about that life just gets in the way somedays.

But if there is one thing I do, its watch SPN every night that its on. And boy can I shout out loud how much I am enjoying this season. After Kripkes 5 years of building up Sams story then 2 years of Sera's OMG everything is about Sam stories and Craver taking 2 years to build up to a decent Dean arc ... we finally have a season, yes a season, not 2-3 episodes but a season of a Dean focused story and man I am loving it.

In fact everything about it, well maybe not Rowena so much and maybe finally Crowley as he is growing his balls back, cause lets face it he's no king of hell recently.

But what this season has really done for me, is put Deans role in s1-5 into a better perspective, seeing all that Sammy is doing (loving Sammy, yes he is Sammy once more) to save Dean is what Dean did in those early seasons for Sammy. Seeing the roles reversed has made me realise that although Dean didn't really have major storylines he was still a major part in those years.

I know the Sam gurls will be hating this season but I hope that they can see just how big a part Sam is still, just as Dean was in Kripkes era.

But just saying AM LOVING THIS SEASON AND DEANS STORY :)
gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:27 am (UTC)
'Sup! :)

I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :) I'm saying the same thing to everyone, but I want everyone to know that my scatteredness is so not intentional, I swear!!

But what this season has really done for me, is put Deans role in s1-5 into a better perspective, seeing all that Sammy is doing (loving Sammy, yes he is Sammy once more) to save Dean is what Dean did in those early seasons for Sammy. Seeing the roles reversed has made me realise that although Dean didn't really have major storylines he was still a major part in those years.

VERY MUCH THIS!!! *points up*

<3
impala1967
Apr. 3rd, 2015 04:26 am (UTC)
PS: did wonder why they thought only Bobby could help, why wouldn't it be suggested that John be contacted ... or am I just assuming that once he escaped hell he went to heaven, cause if not does that mean the boys will have to hunt him as a vengeful spirit?
strgazr04
Apr. 3rd, 2015 05:15 am (UTC)
It's probably more to do with the fact that JDM is too busy with other movies.
(no subject) - gaelicspirit - Apr. 16th, 2015 01:28 am (UTC) - Expand
strgazr04
Apr. 3rd, 2015 05:07 am (UTC)
I agree 100% with everything you said. I miss Bobby so much. J2 play so well in scenes with Jim. It kinda makes me said that Bobby and Dean didn't speak. You could see Bobby wanted to with how many times he asked about where Dean was. I don't like the cliffhanger with him either. The only way they could make that better is if the angels kick Bobby out of hell and he ends up a ghost on Earth again with the boys. Then maybe they save Dean and focus more on fixing all the souls stuck in the veil. They didn't ever fix that last yr right? I feel like after the Kevin episode, they just let that storyline go. Unless I'm forgetting something.

I wanted Sam to wake up Dean too and didn't understand why he didn't until I read your explanation. That makes total sense now.

Dean messing up his hair was adorable. And oddly enough, he looked like s1 Dean with it spiked up so much.

I think Crowley made a mistake kicking Rowena out. Now he can't keep tabs on her. She was better in the dungeon. You know she's going to mess something up somehow. I wouldn't be surprised if your theory was right. I mean why would they bring up Lucifer otherwise? I know a lot of people have speculated about that being the key. It would really make things interesting since you know Lucifer would be gunning for Sam. So it would be a role reversal again going from saving Dean to saving Sam. Unless!.. What if they don't save Dean? What if he's still a demon and Lucifer is freed and possesses Sam again! Then s11 would be evil!Winchesters. Maybe then Crowley and Cas would have to team up to fix them.

Back to this episode though - can someone tell me what that line "the Bobbies are surly" meant? I don't get it.
alleysweeper
Apr. 3rd, 2015 10:13 am (UTC)
*can someone tell me what that line "the Bobbies are surly" meant?*

Every door in the corridor Bobby was in belonged to a Robert Singer. So when he opened them all, there was a crowd of angry Bobbys who weren't cooperating. :)
(no subject) - gaelicspirit - Apr. 16th, 2015 01:28 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - gaelicspirit - Apr. 16th, 2015 01:31 am (UTC) - Expand
jennygeee
Apr. 3rd, 2015 11:47 am (UTC)
Loved this episode so much! Much better than the last two.

I really like Dean and Crowley's relationship, I like that Crowley is 'soft' and think he really cares about Dean and think that Dean is starting to care about Crowley too.

Even though the boys weren't together in this episode and it had the demons and angels again, it worked and it worked well because the storylines were intertwined, they weren't two separate stories.

What I can't remember is - when Dean said "I say we..." in that voice, it reminds me of something else and I can't think of it at all!! It's very annoying, two people take it in turns saying 'well I say...' You probably have no idea what I'm talking about so I'll stop there :D

EDIT: I just remembered what I was thinking about, Changing Channels when the boys were taking of that CSI Miami cop show :D

Great review Gaelic, I love your positivity, it's something I share as well, I love our show and even though there are episodes that I don't enjoy as much as others, I will love it until the end. We've been with it from the beginning and have been on this long journey together, making so many friends along the way, meeting some of them in real life. This show has forever changed my life (I'm saying this with a tear in my eye!).

Thank you Gaelic.

xoxo

Edited at 2015-04-03 09:12 pm (UTC)
gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:32 am (UTC)
I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :) I'm saying the same thing to everyone, but I want everyone to know that my scatteredness is so not intentional, I swear!!

I'm glad you remembered what you were talking about because until you said Changing Channels, I was giving your comment a totally blank stare.

I love our show, too!! I also really hope I get to see you in May! :)
ferrous_wheeler
Apr. 3rd, 2015 12:50 pm (UTC)
Love your review! I really liked this ep too, and you summed it up beautifully. In my head canon I figured that Dean intended to give the kid back his watch and he only asked for it to teach him a lesson, I find it both worrying and *facepalm* that the boys are keeping secrets... again, was a bit disappointed that Bobby didn't mention Dean in his letter to Sam, and one thing all those close-ups of Rowena did was manage to show that she has really great skin ;p Have a wonderful weekend!

Edited at 2015-04-03 12:58 pm (UTC)
gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:32 am (UTC)
I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :)

Thank you so much for reading and commenting. I love seeing you.
qultng1
Apr. 3rd, 2015 12:54 pm (UTC)
Look at me go! It's only Friday and I've read this and ready to comment. :D

You always bring out things that I missed. I'm definitely going to have to rewatch this ep. Don't know where "I" was, but not 100% invested.

My favorite line was "Rough date?". It totally cracked me up. lol I suppose because it showed Rowena that she couldn't just pull the wool over Crowley's eyes like she hoped to and get the reaction she desired. At least she's gone (?) (That comment reminded me of when I used the "Dead Yourself" app on myself and sent the pic to my family. Deputy's remark was "New haircut?" *snort*)

I don't believe Metatron for 1 second. If he said it was a sunny day, I'd have to check even if I were already wearing sunglasses. :/ I figure if he's speaking he's lying.

Secrets NEVER work for the Winchesters - and yet they always seem to go that route. *shakes head* Hope Sam takes Bobby's letter to heart and fesses up to Dean. It's going to go all pear-shaped if he doesn't.

BOBBY!!!!!!!! Holy Crap it was good to see him!!!
gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:33 am (UTC)
I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :) I'm saying the same thing to everyone, but I want everyone to know that my scatteredness is so not intentional, I swear!!

That "Rough date" line was hilarious. He so wasn't buying what she was selling. LOL!

Hope Sam takes Bobby's letter to heart and fesses up to Dean. It's going to go all pear-shaped if he doesn't.

YES!!
jazzyirish
Apr. 3rd, 2015 10:27 pm (UTC)
Hi Gaelic, thanks for sharing all your wonderful thoughts and reactions. I loved this one as well and as you (and others) have mentioned, the story-lines intertwined nicely and made for more cohesive watching.

My lists would align with yours. Loved everything Dean in this one, from the opening nightmare to having a Dr. Phil moment with Crowley. I don't think we've ever seen Dean hustle pool, just Sam. Speaking of Sam, he seems more S1-S2 Sam before "Mystery Spot" sent him down a spiraling path. He's trying to save Dean again, so let's hope he's learned from his past mistakes. But then it wouldn't be Supernatural, would it? ;)

I almost expected a "to be continued..." at the end, since they left both Bobby and Cas in unresolved situations. Do I think the Metatron/Cas road trip will end well? Not on your life. And I too, want Cas to get his own grace back (that won't fade away) so that at the end of the series, he can return to Heaven and have some fun with Hannah. And Bobby really deserves something much better than that room with no view.

I wonder if Dean is going to continue to refuse the Mark's effects or if he is going to get worse. I'm really looking forward to seeing how they resolve this story-line. And I hope that Sam listens to Bobby's advice to tell Dean that he is trying to find a way to get Dean back to himself. Those black eyes were scary - were they real or imagined? Inquiring minds want to know.

Thanks again for sharing your thoughts. I too, appreciate your positive outlook on the show even if I have difficulty seeing it myself. You do encourage me to look however. Take care and I'll see you in a couple of weeks.

Irish

gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:39 am (UTC)
I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :) I'm saying the same thing to everyone, but I want everyone to know that my scatteredness is so not intentional, I swear!!


I wonder if Dean is going to continue to refuse the Mark's effects or if he is going to get worse. I'm really looking forward to seeing how they resolve this story-line. And I hope that Sam listens to Bobby's advice to tell Dean that he is trying to find a way to get Dean back to himself.


I totally agree!!

I'm so pleased you find encouragement toward enjoyment when you read these. It would be hell to watch and be miserable while doing so. Plus I really like seeing you, so there's that. :)
pandi19
Apr. 4th, 2015 05:09 pm (UTC)
Hiya, Name Buddy!

I liked this episode...a lot....a lot a lot. This season or since Dean got the mark last season, I've struggled as a viewer, but I haven't given up and the week it was quite rewarding.

Sam knows his brother well enough that if he were to call attention to the pain Dean was in, it would make Dean uncomfortable, withdrawn, and in all probability a bit surly in an effort to keep Sam from getting too close.
This. After lots of episodes where the writers don't capitalize on how well the brothers know each other, I loved this one.

Lists? Lists are my favorite, this you know. I made mine before I came over here, so I'm giggling a bit at our similairities. We should have viewing parties for any mutual show, the results would be hilarious. *grin*

Loved:
- The sound of Sam's bare feet hitting the concrete floor when he runs to Dean's room.
- Dean cries out of Sam in his sleep? My heart just burst into a million pieces.
- Dean running his hand through his hair.
- Actually getting to see Dean hustle pool.
- "I'm an angel." "You can't be." "Because I'm an atheist."
-"Now shut up & hold hands."
- Those nachos. I need nachos. Like now.
- Rowena saying "hello boys"
- "The Bobbys are surly." Bwahahahhahaha
- The pitchfork in Crowley's drink.
- Dean's family speech.

Liked:
-"The Gambler" playing in Bobby's heaven is perfect.
- "I don't want to see anything. I've been to hell. Thanks."
- Crowley's "Please stop talking."
- "He's one of the good guys. He might be happy to see us." Lol, oh Sam...really?
- Bobby reading the "classics"
- Eeek! Black eyes!
- Dean's immunity to Rowena's whammy reminds me of Sam & Lilith.
- "Balls!"
- "Learn it. Live it. Love it."

Arf?
- Rowena possibly figuring out how to remove the mark is intriguing to me.
- Lucifier?

Other things....
- When Rowena uses Crowley's given (human) name Fergus, I think of Outlander & that Fergus.

Is it too soon to plan another lunch?

Talk soon!
Mandi
gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:39 am (UTC)
I LOVE that you do lists back to me!!!

I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :) I'm saying the same thing to everyone, but I want everyone to know that my scatteredness is so not intentional, I swear!!

So, you said Outlander and my brain paused because, Jamie. :)

Yes, please, to lunch soon.
shazza85
Apr. 5th, 2015 02:30 am (UTC)
This was a wonderfully detailed and discriptive Ramble Gaelic, thanks for the time and effort you share with us.

This Ep had my total attention the minute I saw Dean in that Red Shirt! His hair seemed slightly longer and combed, not spiked. It certainly foreshadowed the twinkle of black eyes we saw latter. I liked everything that happened in that bar: Dean being a local; enjoying his nachos, embracing the chance to hustle the college kids and totaling owning them. Dean used facial expressions during this scene that we haven't seen in quite sometime. Now I know it's a sickness, but I just loved the viciousness of the fight with the cursed kids. Dean moved with total aggression and fluidity. The force of the pool balls as weapons was insane. I couldn't take my eyes off of him, but who would want too? I thought the glimpse of black eyes in the men's room may have saved him from killing the kids by reminding him just how close he is to the edge.

My first glance of Roweena this Ep had me flashing back to Esmerelda in the original Bewitched. Same red hair, same cat eye make up, same sullen attitude, IMO. Maybe I'm just
seeing things. Roweena finally had a purpose, interacting with and trying to kill Dean. I loved that her plan ended up being her downfall. My guess is that she'll come back at the Winchesters harder than ever. Perhaps Crowley can release Olivette from the spell she is under and together they can work on a way to lift the first curse, relieve the MoC.

I really enjoyed seeing Bobby again but hated the private heaven that was presented. I know for myself it would not be heaven if I was not with the ones who went before me. Bobby's absolute loyalty to the boys was awesome as was his practical solution to the predicament. It led to my favorite line of the Ep "the Bobbys are surly" Ha! It did make me wonder where angles go when they die? Do they retire to a private heaven? If so, I would find a way to release Gabrial!

I was more interested in Metetron's scenes than usual. It was great that Sam and Cas took him down so easily. Could he still be of help? Is he lying about his ignorance? I,for one, wouldn't mind Sam putting a few more shots in him to find out!

The final scene in the bar between Crowley and Dean was a great resolution of the dynamics between those charecter so far this season. The family speech you quoted was perfect. My favorite line was " maybe we're getting old" "never saw that coming either" The fact that Dean's words had the powere to influence Crowley's dismissal of his mother was terrific.

Sam's scenes were also really enjoyable. I loved the interaction with Price, the atheist psychic. Did the picture of young Price look like Colin Ford? Again, may just be my eyes.

At some poin in this Ep Crowley implied he couldn't kill Dean. Is Dean immortal to everything but the First Blade? Does this mean he is not in mortal danger during hunts now?

Bobby's letter to Sam was full of great sentiment. "You're a good man Sam Winchester" "Kick it in the ass" shout out to Kim Manners and " keep fighting " a possible shout out to JP's limited edition shirt bringing attention to mental health issues. I do wonder if some of Sam's dormant powers might be re activated by God? by Chuck?

In conclusion I think the pacing of this Ep was marvelous in part because there was no "case". Everything revolved around Dean, fighting him, saving him, planning his demise. Being an adamant Dean Girl that is a structure I can approve of.

gaelicspirit
Apr. 16th, 2015 01:41 am (UTC)
Oooh! What a lovely long comment!! I'm so late replying to everything. I just can't keep up with ANYTHING anymore. Work is taking over my world. I'm sorry. I'll post the Ramble for 10.18 no later than Friday morning. I hope to see you back!! :) I'm saying the same thing to everyone, but I want everyone to know that my scatteredness is so not intentional, I swear!!

At some poin in this Ep Crowley implied he couldn't kill Dean. Is Dean immortal to everything but the First Blade? Does this mean he is not in mortal danger during hunts now?

Y'know I caught that, too, but I thought it more more that Crowley couldn't bring himself to cause Dean's death. And also that Dean's pretty tough and rather resilient. I'm still not sure about the immortality thing.

verything revolved around Dean, fighting him, saving him, planning his demise. Being an adamant Dean Girl that is a structure I can approve of.

Hell yeah! :) *virtual high-five*
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